Hoarding Sugar
 

Is sugar an ideal good to be hoarded for the future. given it should go up in price because of peak oil. If one had a 10 year supply or so, it would come in useful for perserving seasonal fruit etc or even to trade. any opinions

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Yes, I've seen sugar being stored in bathtubs, for future use mostly, for barter. But there were problems, with that approach, as well. High humidity would turn it, to rock. Spring a leak and,,, well, you know what. It needs, to be kept in waterproof containers and that, requires a lot of work. My family used to trade pepper and that seemed to be OK.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

I read a story about the seige of Stalengrad and what people will do for sugar. The sugar warehouse burned down,the melted sugar seeped into the ground.
People bought the dirt that the warehouse sat on...the closer to the surface, the more expensive the dirt.

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Why would anyone want to store sugar in a bathtub. I was thinking in terms of maybe buying it commercially hopefully packaged in plastic.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Why? Where would you store it, if you lived in an apartment building? Or condo? And sugar, in bulk, would not come in any sort of container?
Is why.
Sugar, at the moment comes in paper bags. Not good, for storage.

Talking about Stalingrad. That was war time. Things are quite diferent then. You would not have lived long enough, to enjoy, the sugar stash.
Most people died, during that famous battle. Of starvation, lack of medicine, housing, heat or simply, by stopping a bullet.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

good point, I do have an attic free though. if bought with normal pacakging would have wrap bags in refuse sacks or seal up in plastic crates?

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

I have no use for white sugar. I don't need the health problems it brings now or if SHTF. At least consider going with unrefined sugar if you feel the need to hoard it.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

If you want to put in the work, there might be some reward, for you, down the road :beer: . I quess, it would all depend on, how bad things would get. If war broke out, nothing would get you out, of that mess except [maybe] luck and/or gold coins [to travel to safety]. During those times, "laws" are passed on hoarding anything usefull, with death being the reward.
And an attic would be one of the first places, "they" would look.
If we are talking about "not so bad times" [but yet, bad], then sugar would be a good investment. Until, things went downhill, from there.
But, till then, there are a number of food items, that would come in handy. And others, talked about, in the "survivour" series, of posts. Tobaco, medicine, bullets, jars, toilet paper, just to name a few.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Doesn't honey store a lot better than the white stuff?

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Sugar is one of the heaviest subsidized American industries

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Unrefined would rot. Super processed would be the barter item of choice.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Tinman, you are correct. Honey never degrades, it just changes consistency.

You could safely eat honey from a pharaoh's tomb today.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Refined sugar is very cheap and easy to store. Just vacuum seal it. We want it ahead for jelly and jam making, but also consider it good barter. Salt, sugar, and coffee, were often the only food items frontier people purchased.

Gun powder and nails were near the top on non-food.

Salt and sugar were used in food preservation as well as preparation, is why.

Bolts, bathtub sugar storage is the weirdest idea I ever heard. But in famine conditions, like Stalingrad, the caloric density of sugar give it high value, as the dirt buying demonstrates.

You actually know someone who put sugar in their bath tub? I guess they must have one they never use, but that is nasty. I think the dirt sugar would likely be cleaner. We just put vacuum sealed plastic around the paper it comes in. Honey is good too. Much nicer for eating, but not nicer for jelly making and not so ultra cheap to stock up on now.

Refined sugar can inhibit infection in wounds, too. (osmotic action I suspect) But for some reason it can do that as well as help preserve food, as salt does.

Salt and sugar are the most basic of staples. Even people who grow their own grain as well as fruit and veggies and hunt their meat buy salt and sugar. (Coffee too, but it is a luxury.)

Sugar does take up more space than gold per trade unit worth, by a lot. But as a prep, it is one of the most fundamental ones. Both salt and sugar are very stable except from moisture. Even the humidity in the air they absorb. So they do need to be sealed it you do not want a brick of them to chop up with an ice pick later.

In an attic you would need metal rat and mouse proof boxes too. Rats can chew into plastic to get at the sweet smell of sugar within. Cheap metal foot lockers or new metal trash cans would keep rodents out fine at low cost.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

And Bolts, sugar was rationed during WWII, in the US, with no death squads looking to see if people had some before the ration coupons came in. :confused:

I very much doubt a rationing system would go raid all LDS households who keep the required year of food either. It would just ration.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

:smile: As I mentioned in some other places, I travelled a lot and saw, many interesting things. Life, is full of suprises.
Bathtub storage made sense, to me. A small appartment, one single room plus a kitchen, for 4 people,,, Do your washing, in the kitchen sink. In desperate times, taking a shower is a luksury, not a necesity. Eating, on the other hand...

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

If you live out. consider honey bees

Forget crystal meth-rock candy is what's really hardcore
 

The fact that the body uses sugar as fast fuel makes it more addictive than any street drug.

After an accident years ago I was bedridden for several months. I went through sugar withdrawal, cold turkey. I had such cravings! They say quitting nicotine is bad (don't know, never smoked), but let me tell you, tobacco can be avoided. Sugar is in nearly everything you eat, if it's been processed at all. On trips to the hospital I'd spend every cent in the gift shop on sweets and stretch them out as long as I could. When you haven't had processed sugar for two weeks, and you scarf down a brownie, well, you really don't know what a sugar rush is. And yeah, I indulge the sweet tooth again, although I've cut back quite a bit.

Honey helps, but it just isn't the same. Sucrose. You'll want it, if for no other reason than to wean yourself-and the kids-off of it gradually. If you have any left for bartering, good for you. And it might be profitable in the long run to store some sugar beet seeds along with the other veggie packets.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Good points all. The fact that sugar is subsidised is very interesting that means if the subsidies end and there are energy shortages, it's price could go up X10.
I'm a middle of the road doomer so at worst I've bought something that will hold it's value and as we perserve alot of fruit anyway it wouldn't go to waste. I live in Ireland where the population is lower today then it was in the 19th Century so I don't envisage die out scanerios and the like. For me PO is the isuue ahead and for me will have more econimic consequences. however if the Euro falls apart then 2000kg of sugar is preferable to 2000 Euro in a bank that's just gone belly up.


Thanks AM for the storage suggestions.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

That reminds me of harder times when ya gotta recon for butts on the ground when ya run out of smokes! :smokin:

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And, sugar + water + yeast = alcohol.

Great for barter. There are some yeast strains that can survive in 25% alcohol... 50 proof hooch. Not the best tasting stuff on earth, but in a pinch...

A 50 proof fermentation ain't bad. Legal to do (AFAIK) and avoids the potential hazards of distillation. Easy and cheap to do.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Reminds me....I had a thought yesterday. A lot of people think they will be ok in a survival situation when SHTF....yet, they drink, smoke and consume other drugs. If someone reading this fits that description, and you think you will be OK if in SHTF situation if your supply is cut off and you'll just go without...your probably kidding yourself. Now's the time to clean up, not when you have to. This will be a huge factor in adding to public desperation, IMHO.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Yep, we'll have a whole lot of nasty,miserable people to deal with...Nicotine withdrawl,for two days I was crawling up the walls...

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I would like to add a couple of things, honey with a low moisture content, in a sealed container will last for a long time...that is why you could probably eat "honey from a pharaoh's tomb". Honey with a high moisture content will spoil, and honey that is in a high moisture area, not sealed well enough will attract moisture and spoil. I'm talking about long term storage here. So for honey your Great grand children can eat long after you are gone.....low moisture honey...properly sealed container.....stored in a cool place. A beekeeper can measure the moisture content, i think it should be around 14 percent.:smile: :smile: :smile: Oh yes, find a good beekeeper with honey you like and get the unheated stuff...it still has all the enzymes in it.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Better hoard some toothpaste with that sugar!

If I were spending money on supplies to hoard, it wouldn't be on sugar. I don't even buy sugar now. Sure, a lot of the processed items in my house contain sugar, but I can do with or without it. I have a bit of "sugar in the raw" around the house, but it also is seldom used.

I use honey on my cereal occassionally.

Consider a healthier diet.

If your going to hoard sugar for TSHTF scenario, might as well hoard cigarettes and tobacco for a balanced diet.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Put sugar packages in 5 galllon plastic bucket (you can cram 8 per bucket), purge with hot ice, check and re purge every two years.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Maybe you can buy one, I don't know,
but I made a five gallon bucket lid lifter.

(I don't like to cut the lids at the notches.)

I shortened one leg of a 3 inch corner brace
and bent a little hook in the end of it (the short leg).
Then I attached the modified bracket to the narrow
side of a 20 inch 1x2 (actually 7/8" x 1-3/8"),
about 1/3 of the way from an end.

Works fine, but maybe next time I would attach the
hook to the flat side of the handle. Kinda like a old
timey soda pop bottle lid lifter, but much bigger.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

We did a hike into paradise a few years back, we hadn't even backpacked anywhere before, 2 weeks and 11 miles from the end of the road.We figured out after the only thing we would do different is take hard candy(something sweet) and more coffee.We ran low on coffee so we kept weakening it, eventually it was like dishwater.:haha: We don't even eat candy but when you can't get something sweet you suddenly develop cravings for it. Just something to remember.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

bump for suger

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

I agree. Wartime rationing probably affects the same things that a dollar collapse will, and people will learn to go back to basics for lack of money to live above their means. I am also stocked up on coffee, tea, sugar, salt, pasta, rice, beans, flour, and things to go with them.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

it can get hard too.. somewhere there is an old thread floating around about Gold Duck trying to break up a huge lump of old sugar.. :504:

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Hoarding is such an ugly word.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

jars??? what kind of jars would be of value to store up and why?

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

I'm guessing canning jars, bands, and lids. If there is no or limited commercial food distribution, then you can nature's bounty after harvest so you have something to eat the rest of the year.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Jars full of sugar, silly.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

:111:

ok guys, don't know why I did not think about that.

I did try to seal a few jars of sugar. I have not tried to seal jars of flour anyone try?

mason jars are getting very expensive. good call of some other gimmers years back that bought them by the pallet (good call)

I've been told that all mason jars are now made by the same manufacture somewhere in Wisconsin

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

I went and bought a 50 lb bag today and put some in jars for storage and sealed a few Bags for barter. I am hoping to trade some sugar this winter when the shortage hits. Using Craigslist to barter for some cookies or baked goods

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I spent a couple of hours this afternoon reliquifying some honey that had cristalized. It's not hard to do. My dry sugar, however, does not need treating. The secret with sugar is to keep it dry.

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My father always puts a few soda crackers in the bottom of the sugar pot. They draw out the water like a dessicant of sorts.

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Can I just stick sugar is mason jars with oxy absorbers and keep it forever? Or should I leave the oxy absorbers out or are they even necessary?

Next time we have some money for preps I'm getting a 50# bag of sugar to add to the preps. Right now we have about 10# in the house (the sugar in the sugar jar + a 5lb bag in the pantry)

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

You don't need oxy absorbers for sugar. You need dessicants.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

All you need is a couple slices of apple.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

If you are in a dry climate, fill a jar very very full w/ sugar, seal it and forget it. If you're in a humid climate, might need the dessicants.. No need to vacuum seal.

For the person asking about flour, very similar. It can be stored long-term without vacuum or oxy absorbers. You do need to freeze the flour for 24 hours after jarring. There are eggs / larva in most flour that will ruin your storage if left alone. Freezing for 24 hrs kills anything nasty in the flour, and allows it to be stored for a very long time safely.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Also had a thought on salt...

The giant 70 lbs bags of salt that are sold at hardware stores for pool usage are food-grade salt. The only difference is that they are ground a little more coarse.... For SHTF or future preserving tasks, that should be fine. The bags are less than $10 - $12 each. I have a pool that uses them, so I've got 15,000 gallons of emergency water, and a few hundred extra lbs of salt! woo-hoo!

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

The only difference between refined sugar and unrefined is dirt.

Another important reason to stockpile sugar is that it is very easy to turn it into hootch. Instructions are here.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

"Can I just stick sugar is mason jars with oxy absorbers and keep it forever"?

FWIW: At the Mormon Bishops Storehouse, Sugar is one thing that you do not need to add the oxygen burners into.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

You might want to check the storage life of flour.

http://waltonfeed.com/old/grain/life.html

Flours and Other Products Made From Cracked/Ground Seed

All Purpose Flour
Bakers Flour
Unbleached Flour
White Flour

Whole Wheat Flour
Cornmeal Mixes
Refried Beans

Cracked Wheat
Germade Gluten
Granola Wheat Flakes



After seeds are broken open their outer shells can no longer protect the seed contents and seed nutrients start to degrade. Don't try to store unprotected flours longer than a year. Hermetically sealed in the absence of oxygen, plan on a storage life of 5 years at a stable temperature of 70oF. They should keep proportionately longer if stored at cooler temperatures.



If you remove the O2 from the container, the eggs of the bugs can not live. This is the generally accepted standard. Those bugs can survive winters in Montana in the wild. I am not convinced that the theory of freezing is all it is cracked up to be.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Agreed...the best way to store wheat is in whole berry form...it will keep virtually forever....then grind as needed.

That said, I have kept Waltons WHITE baker flour in their super pail ( mylar bag, O2 pack ) for 7-8 years in a COOL location and it was just fine. Somehow, I ordered a pail by mistake ( or they shipped by mistake ) in one of my big orders and I stuck it aside, forgetting it actually.


Yep.....one thing easy to count on is inflation. :biggrin:

I bought a couple pallets of wide mouth at 7 bucks/case. Got them from a local hardware store that had probably been in business 100 years and carried all kinds of neat stuff....but the last time I went there to get something, it was boarded up and gone....victim of Walmart and the economy I guess....shame.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

For long-term storage I use maple trees. :smile:

Every couple years I boil sap past maple syrup down to maple sugar. Just need to be able to boil water. Then vacuum seal.

Re: Hoarding Sugar
 

Not to mention it makes it difficult to take a shower.